Fic Thoughts

[metonomia]

So, guys, what if the Weeping Angels from Dr Who were in Narnia/came from Narnia?  Because, because...something happened and so they didn't actually get woken up when Aslan de-stonified everybody (maybe because they would be dead of old age by that point or something).  So basically Jadis magic-spawned a whole new race (they all turned human-women-looking and grew wings, yeah hello plot-hole, I see you), and that's why they're weeping, and they go around throwing people back in time because they wish they could go back in time themselves and not get stonified. Petrified. Whatever.
OR it's the remnants of Charn.  The Deplorable Word turned them all into psychopathic but nice killers with crazy time manipulation skillz.
Basically what I'm saying here is that I want the Doctor to cross paths with Narnia lots more.

Then, I'm writing Narnian (world) religious history, and for most of it I'm just making it up however I darn well please, because it's fun, but one thing I wanted to run by all y'all.  What do we think about the Lone Islands in terms of contact with Narnia during the Winter?  My vote is for isolation, because I want them to be incubating a basic Aslan-based religious culture whereas in Narnia during that time they add a bunch of gods/spirits because they need to pray for as much help as they can get, plus also the prophecies seem to say that Aslan has peaced-out until Adam's flesh and blood (holy henna, what if Aslan/the Emperor zapped Adam's literal flesh and blood onto those thrones? Ew.) arrives, and yeah.  But anywho, does it seem plausible that the Witch would have just left off at the shores of Narnia and not tried for the conquering of the islands?  Except, she calls herself Empress, I think...


*goes back to evaluating Geoffrey of Monmouth for literary vs historical value*

Comments

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

I am thinking that it is time I explored Dr. Who. I've never watched a minute of it, but have heard about it from so many people... and you make it sound so interesting...

And Narnian world religious history! Fantastic. The whole bounds of the Winter issue is something I've actually been obsessing over for a bit, and I think it's plausible to say that the Islands were in isolation for the time being. I mean, I think it was Ruth who pointed out that salt water doesn't freeze, and Jadis would have called herself Empress if she'd ruled only the kitchen garden. But really, I've always considered Jadis to be a sort of Narnian problem; Archenland and Calormen seem to have made it through intact and I can't imagine that she would ignore those two lovely countries just to the south only to go after a few miserable islands. Just my two cents.

Also: your journal title- Ingrid Michaelson, yes? I can't believe I just noticed that. *facepalm*

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

You *should* explore Dr. Who! It is really fabulous, and so many (a clear majority, almost all, I'd say) of the episodes are very gripping and very thinky.

YES. Thank you, that validates me nicely! I agree that Jadis is really a Narnian problem - apart from canon seeming to hint at that, I think she'd only really *want* Narnia, the source of the magic, and also I have vague thoughts that Jadis met Tash once and it didn't go so well for her, so she's not going to chance Calormen.

And yeah, it's Ingrid Michaelson! I only just added the subtitle, so I'm not surprised you didn't notice it before. :) Looove that song!

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

*adds Dr. Who to list*

Jadis really always has seemed to be solely a Narnian (well, if you discount Charn) problem; it's the magic thing, I'm thinking. Also: Tash!

That song was what initially inspired my backup plan of fleeing to Maine and opening a diner. That song inspires me.

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

I agree, it's totally the magic thing - she wants to subvert the magic of Narnia to herself so she wouldn't travel too far away from where Aslan sang it into being, and also I think she might be tied to the land somehow by dint of her being there when it was created and also because she ate that apple.

It IS an inspiring song, isn't it? And I can listen to it whether I'm happy or sad, and it always makes me feel better, and it's so pretty, with such fun lyrics!

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

Oh, yes, the apple, yes. And since the world started in Narnia... that's where all the power is, where all the magic is. Why on earth would you want mountains or a great bloody desert when you can have pretty Narnia and all its crazy magic?

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

Well, the matriarchal tribespeople from the desert would disagree there, but yes, exactly!

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

Well, yes, the matriarchal tribespeople would disagree, but everyone knows they're mad from spending so much time in the desert, poor things.

Though I do wonder, if all the magic is centered in Narnia, what, exactly, Tash is doing in Calormen.

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

Tash was the eagle-formed sky god of the desert peoples (who came from another planet, not earth, to Narnia soon after its creation), given to them by Aslan to guard them in the desert, and stolen by the first Calormenes (Archenlandish rebels) along with many women as they rode through the desert toward the oasis that would become Tashbaan. The Calormenes then dreamed/prayed Tash into his better-known form, and also dreamed his cohorts like Zardeenah.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

*blinks*

Narnian (world) religious history indeed.

This is so fantastic. I have no words.

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

*shifty eyes*

I have a whole notebook filling up with this stuff. It is extremely diverting.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

*peers around room*

Oh, yes, diverting is one word for it. I find myself tragically less organized; every month or so, I go on the Great Paper Scrap Hunt to find all of the notes and histories that I've scribbled and then hidden away.

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

Whoa. So awesome. So, maybe Tash represents a more patriarchal view and you have a whole cult of the Mother Desert worship? Maybe the Tash of the desert worship is a sequential hermaphrodite and so can change sex? The dream concept is so cool -- it reminds me of the dreamtime of the aborigines -- I would think in that harsh landscape where there is so little, the landscapes of the mind would be very visual and rich.

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

Oh! You are alive! Yes, I'm hijacking Meto's thread to say, GO Watch Dr. Who and Torchwood. And, I loved the ideas we batted around that maybe Jadis had all sorts of nasty underwater creatures who did her bidding, to a point. But, I really do not think Jadis ever set foot on the Lone Islands -- now, north and west, perhaps, yes.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

*waves*

North and west, indeed! Those damned northern witches, always interfering...

(And, off topic, but... since I probably won't get around to answering reviews for a while *cough*becauseIamlazy*cough*, I just wanted to say how fantastically happy yours made me.)

And, also: your icon is rather hilarious. Bravo. (Brava?)

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

I'll hijack Meto's thread anyway, cuz she understands the brain splodeyness and train wreck appeal of Bedlamsbard but have you read any of her LJ Narnia worldbuilding of her Wars-verse? Trust me, I mean this with the highest of compliments in saying that your worldbuilding and Peter characterization were reminiscent of her work -- except yours is in canon and did not have the incest and insanity. It really shocked me to see that type of superb, complex, world building coming from you -- I had not expected it at all -- we've not had the opportunity really in your shorter work which packs such an emotional wallop but does not have the room to really expand the vision.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

*loves hijacking threads*

I'm feeling extremely complimented right now. Coming from you- what with your crazy-developed vision of not only Narnia but England as well... I've not read anything of Bedlamsbard, but I can see that this, like Doctor Who, is something I'm going to have to look into.

And now that I've finally had time to write again, I've discovered that I can't shut up. It's very unusual. For the first five or so chapters of UtSS, I had trouble working my way up to 3000 words, which, I'd decided, was about the lowest I was willing to go per chapter. The next chapter I'm working on? I've gotten nearly 5000 words in 2 days and I've not gotten through half of what I'd planned to. It's a monster. It's mostly politics, and world-building.

And the Mer-folk. God help me, but I'm probably going to spend pages and pages developing their hierarchy (which is matriarchal, by the way).

Like I said, I don't know what happened.

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

*hijacks thread right back*

Narnian matriaaaaaarchieeeeess! I didn't think I could possibly be more excited about your Mer-folk. And then you wrote the latest chapter. And then I squeeed mightily.

Oh, dear, do I dare? I dare, of course. And would like to ask you to agree not to hold me (or rth) accountable for any explosions of the brain.
http://bedlamsbard.livejournal.com/260939.html
That's good to start with for Bedlam's stuff.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

*reads, stares, reads some more*

...

*brain explosion*

What... what is this? It is beautiful and frightening and causes explosions of the brain. Oh, God...

(And am I also very excited about the Mer-folk... as evidenced by the sheer, staggering amount of pages I have just recently written about them. They have titles. And very complex families. And their men-folk are just a bit whipped.)

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

And I have more fangirling!!! Gah, world building FTW!

And, yeah, that's the usual reaction. *pats* It's well worthy of the *brainsplosion* reaction, and is by turns horrifying and sublime.

And the Mer-folk! I am soooo incredibly excited for this!

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

*is alternating between reading Dust in the Air and typing furiously about the various ships that Peter's annoying harbormaster is muttering about*

It's... it's almost like a train wreck... a beautiful, gloriously written train wreck. It's just so beautiful that even when it's horrifying I can't look away.

*loves world building*

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

That sounds a bit like heaven! Dust in the Air is FAB. As is your world-building.

And that is EXACTLY what it is like.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

Dust in the Air... it's Narnia. But... not. It's a Narnia that's exploded, that's what it is, what with people worshipping the four little gods and hippogriffs wandering around eating ancient king...

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

Hee, you've come to the hippogriffs! (a moment to say LUCY. and SUSAN. I weep for this portrayal of them)

And yeah, Narnia's exploded. Peter & co. are pretty much CRAZY. Narnia it-/herself is freaking crazy. And it's SO GOOD. That is the sum of Dust/Bedlam's universe.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

Yes. The hippogriffs. !!!

LUCY AND SUSAN WHAT ARE YOU DOING. Because I am still in denial about Susan denying Narnia and Aslan. Because she totally stayed behind on some sort of mission from Aslan. There are others who believe this as well. SUSAN IT'S OKAY I LOVE YOU.

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

"there are others who believe this as well"

Mais oui! I am one of them!

SUSAN <333

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

YES! *fistpump*

Susan is simply too fun a character to loathe. She has a terribly interesting story about why she stayed behind, and I am just waiting for someone to tell it...

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

This is where I look around for rth and goad her on in writing Part 3 of TSG.

And where I say that I fluctuate in how I see Susan - on one hand, I see her having a Mission From Aslan that she has to fulfill b/c she's just the best at settling back into England and so he is using her talents, as one does. On the other hand, I see her legitimately forgetting/denying Narnia - but that doesn't make her evil/damned/stupid! A person can be nonreligious but good! A person can hurt their family and deny an important part of themselves but still live a full and worthwhile life! SUSANNNNNN.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

rth!!! Write!!!

Ahem. Yes.

But Susan, really... I used to think that she might have truly abandoned Narnia, but then I became so invested in her character and grew to love her so much that I realized that, if she did abandon Narnia, she wouldn't be the Susan that I interpreted her as, if that makes sense.

Just my two cents.

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

OMG I SEE THAT UPDATE AND ISAMENE IS EOWYN!!! Sort of. More in review, which is coming.

Ahem.

I can totally see that, yeah; it's the interpretation I prefer even when I *can* see her turning away, because Susan! The Queen Susan as I see her and love her just wouldn't really become that stupid girl that so many tend to cast her off as.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

YES. THANK YOU.

In the end, it's not so much the turning away I take issue with, I supposed, but the stupidity she supposedly displays.

Not MY SUSAN.

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

And to think I was going to do conventional Susan for Part 3 (which was then Part 2 because there was no TQSiT). I'm obviously committed to my path and hopefully it will work. But, one of my anonymous reviewers to TSG Part 1 had said that a part of the problem with TLB is that how can it be heaven if Susan is not there? Because she was always the Big Sister! She could wear lipstick and be pretty and still be completely awesome too. Because little girls grow up to be women and there's a place in heaven for them too, isn't there? To which I say, yeah what she said. We were in chat (and really Ilysia, you must waste more time with us on NFFR chat and on Skype) and I got on my tear again about how Susan is always the victim who, if she is not damned, must prove herself through Herculean tasks or disfiguring disease. Or, she is in sexually ambiguous situations and raped 'cuz she totally deserves it, you know? I know that there is a realm of thought that to be cure and holy one must withdraw from the world. Yet, that is not the way I live nor the way I read the Gospels. Why can she not live in the world and still go to heaven? If she cannot, what does that mean for the rest of us? I plainly prefer the alternative -- Susan has chosen to stay, to live, and to contribute. And, as Animus says it so brilliantly, Susan just caught a later train because there were still things for her to do here.

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

Skinny thread! Difficult to reply to!

You write it, rth. I will read. And be awed.

That's just the thing with Susan. It's not the nylons and lipsticks and whatnot that I struggle with; it's her becoming a vain, vapid, foolish girl who can't think beyond the next party. Because so often that's the portrayal you see when Susan stays in England. Because you can live in the world and still be something more; it's not an all or nothing thing. (And part of this is vanity on my part, you understand. Consider this my declaration of: "Susan Pevensie! You will not become a vain and vapid girl after all the hard work I've put into making myself like you!" Vanity of vanities...)

I would love to waste time on Skype and in chat... alas. In the summer, it will be better. So I tell myself. Because I know that I'm missing out on these lovely conversations...

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

Yes. Amen to all of the above. (waaah, stupid sleep; I missed what sounds like a great chat tonight)

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

Ahhh, she's fallen. Yes, brain explosion. and Train Wreck. I've not even tried Dust yet. I adore the Ere Let We Loose the Legions (the xover), a story over on the House of Pevensie site about the children where King Jack (a Narnian doctor) tries to save his cousin's life, and the one in the Wars verse involving the Kabuki drums and Susan and Lucy doing the sword dance. Just... Wow. And then you get to the PC AUs (there are two, including the one with the kids) and that's when it all comes unglued when you realize that Narnia is in Peter's head and when he left her she got really, really angry. The world building that oozes from every sentence is astounding, even if I disagree with some of it, which I do, and very, very strongly.

I've not read your update yet! WAAAAH! Matriarchy in the sea from what I gather! Oh! Have you read Animus' Lucy story???

[ilysia-039.livejournal.com]

The whole Wars verse is just... is just...

This will take much exploration.

Her story with the Mermaid? Because if so then yes, even though I can't think of the title at the moment. YES, and YES. Wonderful story.

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

The lovely thing about Who and Narnia, like Buffy and Dark Materiels and Secrets of Droon is that interdimensional travel is assumed, so you don't need any confusing explanation. It just IS and it's very easy to "run with it" as the saying goes. They lend themselves beautifully to xovers. The statues could even be some animated sort of horrid creature that Jadis thought was a Daughter of Eve that wasn't and they then escaped through a rift between the worlds... and... so many possibilities...

[wingedflight21.livejournal.com]

Or maybe there were these... uh, I dunno, Siren things - you know, the version of sirens that you really, really rarely hear about where they have the body of a woman and the wings of a bird - or was that just from a story I made up? Anyhow, some women with wings in Narnia (could include men too, I guess) and they were all turned to stone by Jadis but something went wrong so they were never after able to be turned back by Aslan (maybe they'd done something wrong so this was their punishment?). But anyway, I love the idea. I'm thinking this must be done.

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

Harpies! From Narnia!!

[metonomia.livejournal.com]

Yes, as rth says - harpies! I love it! Maybe a sort of hybrid between harpies and humans, giving them the more humanoid look...

[wingedflight21.livejournal.com]

Oh yes! Yes, indeed! Maybe the Weeping Angels are the offspring of the harpies and humans, and they were the ones that got turned to stone.

[rthstewart.livejournal.com]

And then, Meto LJ exploded with harpies, matriarchy, mer-folk, bedlamsbard, and the origins of Tash. We need a world building icon or three.